This week in Bitcoin- 7-27-2018- Fake ETF news! Down on Ethereum? Israel & more!

Hello everyone hello everyone this is
adam meister the bitcoinmeister the
disrupt meister welcome to the one
bitcoin note this week and bitcoin what
am I saying
today is July the 27th 2018 strong hand
long term thinking don’t be impulsive
people all right I was talking really
slow there because I just want to make
sure we got on the air and we are on the
air and I am so pumped to be here today
and someone’s already sent oh my god
someone has already sent super chat but
I just want to introduce everyone before
we do the super TAC we got exact fall
coming in from DC what’s up we got
Daniel coming in from Mexico we got that
hey hey hey we got Arjun
Balaji making his debut coming in from
New York City that’s Arjun baby he’s got
an awesome Twitter it’s linked to below
welcome to the show Arjun so then and
then we got a dapper lo making his
second appearance coming straight are
you in Tel Aviv today with worry today
at in Tel Aviv that’s nice baby coming
straight out of Tel Aviv and by the way
Molotov cocktail in the super chat sent
888 8088 cents he says shabbat shalom
bitcoin is a gift from Hashem continue
doing your thing Adam you bring a lot of
value to those who listen well kvass
Shalom to you I I would if you’re Jewish
I would encourage all of you to do
Shabbat where we’re not all perfect but
anyway let’s jump right into Bitcoin
here we’ve obviously got a
my guests are here and people in the
chatter coming from all over the world
yesterday was a wacky day and it really
sums up the wacky week in Bitcoin a lot
of us have been anticipating the the
legendary ETF which is who’s doing
either one of the guys who are giving
their names of the paddock the van eck
solid X ETF well suddenly we get an
announcement that the Winklevoss 8 ETF
is not a creep well well I mean what is
this a year ago or something like that
everybody panics it’s come it’s
ridiculous I got on the air and said
it’s fake news it’s it’s this is not
what we’ve been waiting for but of
course people are so impulsive they see
the word ETF rejected and they all start
selling the price went down in terms of
fiat then it went back up again as I
Zack what’s your take on all this look
at the lesson here the lesson here is
we’re not were a year past a year ago
like at the risk of stating the obvious
it like who cares the denied ETF is
denied like I don’t think it matters
I love the wincle V I think they’re
great they’re at least from things
they’ve said like Bitcoin maximalist
more or less which I myself am please
don’t hate me anyone in your audience if
you’re not but I love the wincle of AI I
think it’ll be great when they their net
worth surpasses that scrub mark and I I
think the ETF is a great way to sort of
catalyze that development but the retail
was denied a year ago it’s it’s nothing
new and I I really don’t care about that
bit of news so I think that I think the
purple may begin to this later but the
ETF had nothing to do with the price
action it dipped right as futures closed
and then it’s shot up so anything
anything having to do with the price any
narrative about the price and the ETF
denial is faked news I don’t that’ll buy
it all this is the thing is this it it
was not a real it was not an important
news story I think we can all agree upon
debt but when it came out there are
people out there who do try
manipulate the market based on fake who
try to weaken people’s hands I think
that I think that can’t be denied that
some that there were uneducated people
out there that thought oh wait a second
this is it this is the denial that we
didn’t think was going to happen with
bad act and now we sell I mean I don’t
like to worry about the Fiat price
everyone knows here this from murder of
the show one Bitcoin equals one Bitcoin
that’s the that’s the price to me but I
do like to discuss the I guess when a
new story comes out that’s not true
how people can be impulsive and help you
have to blow it out of proportion I
think that was another lesson from
yesterday that if you’ve been through
this long enough you’ve heard it all
you’ve seen it all it was just another
it makes Bitcoin illegal type of type of
story in my opinion and it’s we just
need to be reminded that these things we
cannot overreact to these things we have
to call them out when we see them so I I
just I just tried to get everyone’s it
so Arjun what did you think about all
this yeah I think to give the listeners
a little bit of context around what
happened yesterday I think there’s a
couple of distinct facts that you have
to sort of process one is that the
proposal that was rejected yesterday
wasn’t you know what many people cluding
me believe is the strongest proposal
that’s even in the market for a Bitcoin
ETF profit the second is that the sec
which you know has to approve ETFs under
an individual exemption because the
original securities laws didn’t provide
for ets the same way they do mutual
funds and other types of closed-end
funds the sec you know they came out and
they have a process for pushing the
decision on any of these products and so
and and they can push this for a maximum
of 240 dates they first they push it for
45 days then they can push it for
another 45 days then 90 days and then
they finally have 60 days so about 240
days before they have to make it this is
that’s the maximum time they can put
something so yesterday was was just
about the last day that they had the
opportunity to make the decision to
reject it but I think the most notable
thing that came out of all this was from
hester pierce who she presented a
dissenting opinion on the linker bots
etf application which was you know very
strongly in favor of some sort of better
regulated product coming to market and
so i think that the the Vanek CBOE batch
proposal which is you know said to be
first evaluated sometime you know around
august 10th by then i think that there’s
a number of major differences between
the Winklevoss proposal and the fennec
the coin ETF so of which i think the
kind of three or four primary things or
you know one day instead of just
focusing on gemini and kind of the
liquidity and market activity on gemini
the Venna ETF focuses on big coin buying
that’s happening in size
over-the-counter across you know the
market the second thing and and deriving
pricing from this as a result the second
distinguishing factor to me is that the
one of the major concerns for any type
of PDF product is going to be around
custody and security and the Vanek
bitcoin product actually has insurance
associated with it and the third thing
is that the product is specifically
given the size of the offering which I
think each share is is it’s very sizable
I think it’s like one hundred and fifty
thousand dollars the Bitcoin roughly the
Bitcoin that represents these
institutional minimums I think you know
separated considerably because this
isn’t a need here product that retail
investors can potentially go out and buy
and they have a lot more sort of that
the retail investors will need a lot
more sort of consumer protection so I
think in reality when it does come to
market when it does come time to approve
I do you think I tweeted this out a few
weeks ago but I think we’ll see a push
on the decision as well so I wouldn’t
get too excited about that
but ultimately I don’t think I think
yesterday was largely not that I think
an ETF approval especially given the
dissent and the and the clear sort of
use that it wasn’t a consensus decision
I think makes me fairly excited well
again I want to bring up something that
you you touched upon with the van act
one that’s everyone again is
anticipating a decision in August this
thing is going to get to the leg it’s
going to get delayed I mean but I mean I
think people have to have a strong hand
and just not be disappointing it just
been gifts delayed the decision gets
delayed until next year I mean I think
it’s very pop do you think it’s possible
that an ar-10 that it’ll be next year
even that this might get delayed this is
a so I I think it’s very I think it’s
probably most likely that it will be
approved if not very late this year
early next year
um the consideration that I have there’s
that you have congressman saying out and
saying Bitcoin should be made illegal
you have the Department of Justice doing
research on bitcoins spot price market
manipulation I think the way that I see
it is that you know if you’re selling
Bitcoin based on anticipated ETF
approval or disapproval you probably
have a much lower timeframe and and
higher time preference than someone
who’s willing to hope to all this news
if you’re an unsophisticated investor
who wants an exposure to Bitcoin I’d
probably you know own less Bitcoin and
sort of be take more comfort in being
able to hold the position through all of
the volatilities because you want to be
in the market when the ETF feds approved
instead of betting on you know short
term momentum one direction or another
exactly exactly in the end of the day
this there’s going to be Bitcoin ETF in
the future period but I think everyone
can agree agree on that so don’t get
staked out by winkle by stories or
freaked out because there’s a delay or
because some sociopath and the
government is saying bad things all
right can I say one thing out yes I did
I did just really quick I did want to
touch on Esther Pierce’s dissent like
you mentioned very much worth a read
Esther used to work
Mercatus with Jerry Brito who now leads
up the coin Center obviously well-known
Bitcoin and cryptocurrency
permissionless blockchain advocacy group
in DC I heard assent is very well
reasoned she exploded on Twitter when
she published it she gained like 8,000
followers overnight but that aside
definitely check it out it just has her
peers on Twitter I think you’ll learn a
lot about how she’s thinking through and
like he mentioned that this rejection of
the wincle VHF was not unanimous I think
those opinions are very well worth
understanding so go go read that alright
all the government officials learn from
Hester peers learn from Chen Carlow
crypto dad at the CFTC mmm yeah if you
post bullish news about Bitcoin or other
crypto assets you will get a ton of
followers but that’s a real good point
everybody found that like button if
you’re enjoying the show so far I want
to say go back to my show yesterday I
linked to Hester Pierce’s dissent so go
to disrupt meister comm see the archive
see yesterday’s show and link to below
is Hester Pierce’s dissent and hopefully
our the show I’ll I’ll link to it below
here Adam what what what are you
thinking about all this news about uh
the sec and these Bitcoin ETFs has it
has it jumped on your radar has it
piqued your interest what’s what’s your
opinion um my opinion is that
essentially first of all I wanna say
that the previous two speakers I think
summer is in a very good fashion um the
the material issue that they they didn’t
want to deal with the Winklevoss ETF was
about the fear of the manipulation in
the market and given that um this this
Vanek ATF is backed by the the futures
it seems that that whole issue of like
how do we get how do we actually settle
how to eat configure the price that’s a
subtle thing and so I think eventually
at some point once you’ve got those
futures and the commodities exchange
it’s kind of a done deal at some point
someone’s going to get an ETF proof um
it’s just a matter of time there’s no
real way to except to stop it I guess at
this point you’ve all they’ve already
legitimized the asset too much
yeah that’s basically it in nutshell
I’d also say it’s interesting to see
that the the futures curve is inverted
so you see that people are willing to to
essentially to pay more for something
that that comes due earlier which is an
interesting phenomenon it means that
people actually want to settle
physically um so that’s one thing to
observe in the market you know what
someone just did say I mean wasn’t there
just a physical settlement recently that
circle yeah yeah yeah you did you just
have something to say about that Zach by
the way this is we’re expanding it kind
of subject here a little bit I I don’t I
just thought the headlines tweeted on
Twitter I was like Oh awesome that’s
cool but I didn’t reread about it so I
yeah there were there was the first EFP
exchange for physical was conducted
between two counterparties on on futures
which is pretty exciting I think that
that’s a you know especially a bit point
where you don’t need to take physical
delivery you know having a structure
like that I think is really awesome it
sort of sort of paving her way that this
is normal kind of behavior yeah then
this is this was that was good a big
news story that people didn’t I’m glad I
got brought up Daniel the best for last
there are a lot of people out there but
Daniel by the way is the legendary 21
million and a lot of people are like
where is he he’s missing and still you
can’t see him so he’s he’s mysterious
but his new twitter is linked to below
Daniel what is it do you what are your
thoughts about this etf situation or has
it all been said I really don’t see yeah
I mean I really don’t care because as as
long as you know the price it’s it’s
like this it’s low I can get some more
and people can get some more and they
should get somewhere when it comes down
to the like the ETF getting approved
it’s kind of its kind of moon bit point
is kind of moon and people are gonna be
like why didn’t I buy it when he was
like eight thousand dollars that’s the
best way is the practical way of looking
you know and that’s I mean I think
that’s that’s what I
to convey that you know we’re gonna hear
rumors and thud and
and punks about the ETF’s when’s it
going to come and the bottom line is
it’s going to happen and there’s going
to be a lot of money flowing into
Bitcoin from these institutions it’s a
matter of when and just be patient have
a strong hand do any of you guys on the
panel by the way have anything to say
about it you know no I don’t want to I
don’t want predictions of when it’s
going to happen but your thoughts about
how early we are in in all of this in
terms of institutional money flowing
into Bitcoin sure I I think I’m happy to
fill in I have I am an active investor
and trader in this ecosystem and have
institutional investors who I brought
into this face previously I’ve worked
with let’s explain our hedge funds I got
to see a little bit of the institutional
mindset and now you know I spend a lot
of my time talking to family in offices
to high net worth individuals to
billionaires pitching them the story of
why you know this was a new asset class
and more importantly why I didn’t think
they should be buying Bitcoin we’re
starting to see Marc Lasry from Avenue
come out and say you know hey I’m
holding one percent of my net worth in
Bitcoin people in Silicon Valley have
been saying this for years because when
Susannah wences from Zappo has been
evangelizing this up and down the block
since 2011 but I think that we are
starting to see a lot of the
institutional capital come in and you
know a lot of it because institutional
investors are less familiar with the
custody process they’re less familiar
with you know and the idea of owning
their assets directly and taking custody
of it themselves I think that the real
flood that a lot of people are waiting
for you know institutional investors are
ramping up their investment into other
funds that can hold and invest in these
assets for them but I think that the
real inclos’d will come from launch it a
lot of these insurance and custody
products coinbase custody launched last
month where
quietly but I think that there’s six or
seven more different custody products in
the pipeline that will watch over those
six to eight months yeah I definitely
agree and I think coinbase is custody
launched like you mentioned was very
quiet and that’s symptomatic of how
institutional investors are entering
Bitcoin like institutional investors are
here they’re not going to enter Bitcoin
with like a cannonball splash they’re
gonna enter it very slowly because they
don’t want to buy Bitcoin at $20,000
they’d much rather buy it at $4,000 and
I think I definitely don’t think the
bottom is in for the price I’ll just say
that as an offhand remark but
institutional investors are here they’ve
been here much longer than people think
and I was just chatting with Jack
Mallory’s from Zaap yesterday about
Chicago finance and that whole scene and
he said the same thing what they’ve been
here much longer than people think
they’re continually figuring out and
accumulating more Bitcoin and it’s not
going to sort of tomorrow we’re all
gonna wake up oh shoot institutional
money is here and the price is now
35,000 it’s gonna be very slow and they
would much rather buy cheap Bitcoin like
all the rest of us so it’s it’s not
going to be this explosive event its
usual money is here we’ll continue
growing and just sort of buy more
Bitcoin because by the time they’re all
here and they have it you you want to
have some too so the smart rich people
are silent they’re yeah okay you see
that’s there you go people there’s a
lesson you learned you know you were
talking about how you like the week of I
I want the wincle I to end up being
though you know wealthiest the first
trillionaires because that means my
Bitcoin will be worth that much more I
think I’m all for this saying I try to
end I tell people on the show you want
to emulate the wealthy people you don’t
want to like the a is there’s so many
people who love to hate the blink of eye
I’m like dude let’s uh yes I I think it
was Kevin Pham on Twitter that first
called this but the real flip inning is
not going to be ether over Bitcoin it’s
going to be the window by over Mark
Zuckerberg okay yeah yeah I remember
that one too so it lets actually you
know let that’s a good segue into
this is a legitimate this is a there has
been over social media just the people I
talked to the people I follow or
whenever there’s a negative sentiment
toward aetherium right now I mean it’s
it’s clear and you know in fact just a
few months ago is the you know the
greatest thing since sliced bread or
whatever and these things are cyclical
but I’m we’ll start with Arjun on this
one because you’re you’re in touch with
a lot of rich people a lot of the you
know traders institutional investors
whoever are what what’s the feel for
etherium are there gonna be aetherium
ETFs are people still as excited as they
were is this just a minor trend or what
are your thoughts sure um that’s a good
questions there but I’ll start off I’ll
disclose I am actually short either and
this is definitely not financial advice
but I think that you’re right that the
sentiment has been turning on ether over
the last several months
one of my friends friend and Bernstein
at Texas capital put out a really good
it’s light but a 45 page report on why
they’re very skeptical they’re medic
covers it covers it in pretty good
detail I would recommend I’ll send you a
link so you can link it below but I
think that the primary value proposition
for Bitcoin versus either to
institutional investors is becoming more
and more apparent where bitcoin is a
form of unsensible non-sovereign money
it’s very low entropy it’s very secure
very constrained based layer there’s a
payment layer built on top of it and
then there’s gaps like the in the fabric
protocol and the number of other
experiments on potential layer three and
Beyond type structures whereas I think
the theorem has taken sort of the
opposite approach where you know they’ve
started with building gaps and funding
these gaps and in a sort of capital
market structure they’re looking at you
know payments layers now Vitalik
proposed a fixed supply last year but
ultimately like the the monetary policy
but theorem is quite unclear
you can see Bitcoin as a form of digital
gold some money you know and as a
potential inflationary hedge or a
long-term reserve currency I think that
there’s sort of what l or what many
people are calling the utility
hypothesis around aetherium similarly to
earning this reserve currency status I
think is much more skeptical and there’s
a number of sort of technical and
structural issues I think that we’re
starting to see where the theorem I go
into that detail but I think even purely
on sort of the idea of digital gold
alone you know we’re seeing it across
you know the centralization of full
nodes with the etherium we’re seeing it
across uncertainty rent monetary policy
we’re seeing it around you know Bitcoin
using leveraging the security of
proof-of-work and hash trade all over
the world with etherium you know being
less secure you know with with having
this highly complex turing-complete
programming language with all sorts of
attack surfaces moving towards you know
proof of stake which is you know sort of
PVD and untested at scale and so
everything from you the usability the
durability of Bitcoin versus ether the
liquidity that’s available in the market
the sort of different all the different
products that are being built around
Bitcoin whether it’s CBOE cime futures
etf proposals fiat on-ramps OTC yes I
think it’s it’s all in contrast to
either in addition to the fact that
aetherium you know has now a dozen
different competitors that have all
raised hundreds of millions if not
billions of dollars that are all trading
at multi-billion dollar market caps that
are all trying to capture the same use
case where so I remain kind of skeptical
of aetherium as it stands relative to
Bitcoin and I think that that will that
I don’t think that trend is is changing
anytime soon massive you know who have
my absent massive technical improvements
I hope I’m the etherium fellowship and
okay now but before we go to Adam
because I know I hadn’t gonna have some
things to say about a theory I want that
I want to say at least one thing here
well you talk about that aetherium the
46 page aetherium report that was it
that was actually mention that in a
previous show of mine I forgot which one
so I it’s linked to ball of some old
show of mine so yeah that was pretty
intense and that’s kind of what almost
triggered some of the negative sentiment
that was out there or kind of summarized
at all you mentioned that digital gold I
mean if you’re not trying to be digital
I mean that that is something it is it
is a different type of animal than
Bitcoin I think there are you people
remember that I think the way I think
about it is that any non pegged token
right any any token that isn’t pegged to
another asset is attempting to be
currency or money in some place right
where and it’s in the same way that you
know they’re sort of there are
currencies but they operate in this
really small ecosystem right you might
have a Tyrian which can operate in the
capital financing ecosystem of icos and
have all this infrastructure and and all
these apps built on top of this you can
have something like file point be a
currency that’s used in this file
storage system but I look at that like
gift box right when you’re younger the
best gift that you could get from your
on at least from my aunt was a Visa gift
card because it’s just cash I can use it
wherever I want
it’s most liquid it’s accepted by
everybody and it it’s I know exactly
what I can do with it if she gave me a
gift card to Macy’s that would seriously
constrained the utility of that gift
card even if you had to look at the
value of the Macy’s gift card even in
dollar terms it wouldn’t be worth one it
wouldn’t be worth it on a one-to-one
basis and so the way I see it is that we
have thousands of different competing
currencies because these are all non peg
some of them operate in micro economies
others like Bitcoin and some cash and
Manero and other currency type
instruments or attempting to become
globally use but I think that
what we’ll see over the next you know
five to ten years is whether the market
is going to converge on a very small set
of viable currencies with some utility
protocols associated with included in
that bunch but whether we’re going to
continue to see thousands and thousands
and of tokens and see that supply
eventually got trending towards infinity
I’m skeptical that that will happen
I do think in theory I’m another smart
contract protocols programmable money
has the has a very very strong chance of
creating mass societal impact but I
don’t know whether that transcends into
being a good format water
alright Adam you have done a lot of work
with the theory on you probably have a
lot to say about what Arjun just said Oh
lots of while I agree that I guess I may
be doing a bit of a favor here to them
but I say while I agree on that there’s
you know some technical issues with it
then and they that can be solved at the
technical level think that the thing is
here there’s no real incentive to solve
it because right now is just like kind
of no floating around and you can always
talk about you know proof of stake or
this is gonna happen you’re gonna have
plasma or whatever the thing may be that
you know that like tells the market that
they should you know wait a bit longer
and that you know it’s like pre room you
know like we’re pre-prep so don’t so
don’t measure it yeah don’t live it that
there’s no way theorem applications that
are delivering anything that don’t
measure that there’s no real economic
utility or I mean created here it’s all
like this very large diaspora of
undefined like what does that thing do
it’s Timmy when I look at something like
a Bitcoin when I got in to pick one
attract me it was very obvious to me
essentially you know okay this is gonna
be a better form of money more people
are gonna understand this is a better
form of money and there and then it’s
gonna evolve from there and more and
more people will adopt it and you look
at something like a theory when you say
okay the the things being marketed as
you know generalized
touring complete like you know computer
system that’s redundant and synchronized
with everywhere in the cloud and it just
seems to me that there’s a lot of
confusion here because the there’s not
really much money do you want to block
drain beyond like you know their
creating assets you know moving around
maybe putting some predicates and
constraints on how to move them around
like told me I said but so so I think
that this whole idea of building apps on
aetherium is is flawed its premise and I
just think that it lacks the attraction
and because of that that you’re gonna
continue to see more and more companies
and projects come on aetherium and do I
see or capitalize themselves for things
that don’t really need of auction and
that aren’t supposed to be on the
blockchain and I think that maybe I’m
gonna lose a bit more focused on doing
what the blockchain is good for um mrs.
Hurley let’s say just going after
financial instruments there’s gonna be a
bit more successful um yeah that’s just
my two cents very good before we move on
I mean you have I mean your Zen protocol
is it deals with the theorem correct
yeah um so yeah it’s a what we have is a
new different type of block chain one
that essentially takes the same kind of
model that Bitcoin has but it allows you
the same technical architecture that
Bitcoin has but it allows you to make it
more programmable um based on all this
kind of tech that we did which I think
may be a bit boring now to talk to the
audience about essentially solved by
solving the gasps problem you can have a
system that is both programmable yet you
can in paralyze it and you can execute
the code a lot faster because you don’t
have to sit there and count it so that
that’s the like our orthogonal to I mean
but you I think it’s interesting you’re
you’re very you gave a very honest a
review of the theory I’m there but I
mean theory is the success of aetherium
I mean it it will help your your project
to if it does succeed I mean it has to
succeed why well I mean but then that’s
I thought you were built around a theory
and I thought there was sort of it
there’s no dependence on it well I mean
I guess I guess before the end of the
show we’ll get into exactly what Zen
protocol I guess I’m jumping ahead a
little bit here too so well we’ll get
back to that in a second can I say I
think so I’m generally bearish on
ethereum ETH an ATC also but I think
something we should notice which is sort
of my philosophies
Maximus on all alts is alts exist in my
perception of the crypto crypto
landscape writ large as very interesting
and useful experiments on cool ideas
that could be implemented on top of
Bitcoin into the future prediction
markets or information trading compute
excess computer space sharing all of
these things are fascinating and they’re
being built right now on separate block
chains which are obviously like
inherently much weaker and much newer
than the Bitcoin blockchain but all of
those ideas three five seven years in
the future can be built on secondary or
tertiary layers of the Bitcoin base
layer protocol and be wildly successful
so saying alts are garbage out of hand I
think is a bad approach also very useful
because they’re testing ideas and have a
very limited upcoming expiration date
but those ideas are useful
insofar as they can be built on top of
Bitcoin in the future and I don’t think
etherium is the most durable platform to
be building those ideas but Bitcoin
definitely is because of the
characteristics of its base layer that’s
that’s my take yeah I would add one last
thing which is that I don’t definitely
don’t want to imply that all depths are
useless for that gap building depth
isn’t a good idea because I think that
there’s sort of five different kind of
depths like in ordered utilities and
block chains I can think of offhand I
think that the disconnect between a lot
of people in the etherium and the sort
of other ecosystem and you know people
with people in Bitcoin is that people in
Bitcoin primarily viewed block chains as
a form of free speech and people in the
etherium and other ecosystems they’re
sort of mental model isn’t oriented
round block changes for speech which
I’ve written about but it’s rather
oriented around like block chains as a
different kind of database that’s how we
end up with all these gaps and different
apps that are being built that don’t
require block chains at all I think that
block chains are work as free speech
where you only really need them if you
if your product bio ties the censorship
resistance above all so where
see this we see this in unsensible value
transfer viability I think that use case
of decentralized exchanges non-custodial
trading swab start tools I think super
useful prediction markets I am actually
interested I’ve tried auger in you know
was it was painful to Ron I had to I had
to connect to in pyrrha because who in
their right mind once in etherium get
their parity node but it was cool
I think non fungible collectibles
potentially interesting are they gonna
be valuable I think it remains to be
unseen Dow’s I think could be
interesting but it rains fancy almost
everything else let me put my supply
chain transparently on a blockchain etc
I think all these other blockchain
businesses are largely non sensible it’s
unclear where valuable group because
fundamentally block chains are about
censorship resistance and
disintermediation of trust and not
they’re not rent-seeking nature how will
these businesses make money if
fundamentally what they’re trying to do
is disintermediate their entire business
model and remove the rent-seeking
inherent in the business model either
they’re disingenuous about what they’re
doing or they have no idea what they’re
doing and that’s kind of where where I
rest when I look at a lot of things
which this is alright i I want to get to
Daniel because we haven’t gotten to him
for a while there are a lot of altcoin
talk here are all points just trash
someone’s what’s going on Daniel I think
there are test nets for Bitcoin and the
thing with aetherium is that other than
crypto kiddies I haven’t seen it do
anything useful and I wonder what’s
gonna happen when root star comes into
Bitcoin which pretty much does the same
thing it’s just gonna be another test in
my opinion yeah that’s that’s a lot of
Bitcoin people say that you know our
root stock RSK is gonna be able to do
everything that a theorem can do what
good how about this there there this was
also alluded to and I asked the whole
panel this but Daniel I asked you first
we etherium is a theory on the next
etherium or
because I always say Bitcoin is the next
Bitcoin everyone tries to be the next
Bitcoin it seems like they’re all these
other coins out there yose for example
that wants to be the next aetherium it
is there are one of them going to be
able to overthrow a theory of a– as the
next aetherium or is aetherium in place
does it has it set its places for what
it is in the cryptocurrency hierarchy
dang I think it’s gonna be cerium you
know but who knows yes
oh I’ll mention on a cerium skier
Rashard who’s a great guy
if you don’t follow him or haven’t
chatted with him do so there’s a short
video that he posted a couple months
back I think and he breaks down
different types of maximalism and he
explains how you can be an ethereal
maximalist but that type of maximalism
is separate entirely from any form of
monetary policy sort of a platform
maximalism for all of these DAPs and
that sort of thing which i think there’s
problems with that with the theorem has
platformer maximalism but it’s very
interesting to understand useful to
understand that maximalism is just a
word that has many different
applications pierre does a great job
breaking that down and check out that
video but as as far as platform and
money I’m sort of bearish in both
regards on aetherium right now that’s a
really good distinction because I am
often accused although I would consider
the compliment of being a Bitcoin max
Lawler’s where my actual position is
sort of what my friends and I are
calling shit point minimalism or a form
of like monetary neo gold maximalism
where I’m just interested in whatever
has the potential to become future money
when I think that that’s where a lot of
the disagreement sort of applies because
there is a small minority camp in the if
you’re an ecosystem that thinks hey
ether might not be worth anything
long-term but there will be a lot of
cool things being built on top of it
which you know kind of you know as in
form of money he doesn’t make no sense
what will interest through that which I
guess this is a little bit better in my
books are a little bit more logical
found that like button everyone remember
panel members you could ask each other
questions – I know some of you host your
own shows that are used to ask you
feel free to disagree in whatever Adam a
lot has just been sad there about it I
don’t know if you have any closing
thoughts on aetherium or audit more than
that they did some good things I’ve
heard so you know about the the first
question obviously is aetherium gonna be
the platform is it not I think that that
you know doesn’t matter who it is it’s
kind of people want to people want to
get in on the next pump right and so one
day they send there’s a line if this
incentives aligned to go on to the next
one I’m I’m almost I’m I’d say I’d bet
my money more than more than seventy
eighty percent probability that some
other platform will definitely surpass
because the incentives just like why not
do that people want to get in the next
pump you know the guys who got in on
ether or you know thumb and you move on
to the next thing because bitcoin is
kind of defendable because it’s like it
has the network effect because of being
money but this thing that’s more vague
as being a that platform I think
definitely that will be overtaken now
another thing that I think are we made a
good point year that was a blockchain
versus free as free speech versus the
type of database I think that’s a great
kind of districts and distinction that’s
exactly the Nigerian the last thing I’d
say is also kind of a oddly a Bitcoin
maximalist in stock I like to think of
myself more as a pragmatist but I’ll
save that um a lot of times I hear
people fall into this trap that like
pick winners definitely up into this
strong and trap of um well you can bid
bill down on Bitcoin to so we’re gonna
have you know it’s great to see that
this these testing and these use cases
in ABCD whatever but at the end of the
day you know we’ll just we’ll just bring
it into the client and and I don’t think
that that that’s necessarily the
argument or the position that um that
the Bitcoin maximalist should be taking
simply because a may not be necessarily
true it’s kind of hard to me anything
going to climb it but beating also
because at the end of the day main
strength should be money and the second
that you try to compete on other avenues
that you’re not so you can make stuff
and you’re probably going to lose and
there’s no reason to and that’s it and I
think that it would help all the corners
focus argument respect yeah there’s my
Adam Adam if I could get one last thing
in the last thing I would add is that
for people who think that ether can
become money just like Bitcoin the path
to sort of monetization of ether is
almost exactly the same as that that to
monetization of Bitcoin but Bitcoin has
a very large accumulated head start it’s
more immutable it’s more censorship
resistance because it’s more
decentralized there’s the smartest
developers in the world there’s more of
them that are working on Bitcoin not
even because they’re being paid
necessarily but because they’re
evangelical right there’s a cult of
Bitcoin maximalism there’s a large
number of people in the world people
nothing but Bitcoin were happy to do so
but there’s almost I don’t know event
you Theory Maximus in real life maybe
Adam you do but I don’t know of any
Theory Maximus that are stringent
against holding anything else and I
think that the way I see emergent money
as a coelom
and sort of political phenomena rather
than technological one that’s really
really a key indicator for MIT they’re
very good points here and s before we
move on does anyone have any aetherium
thoughts that they wanted to share any a
theory Umbra is we’ve we’ve had a pretty
intense aetherium discussion here before
we move on to the next subject matter
all right good
all right well everyone a lot of people
tune in to this show to get the
international flavor because I always
try to bring on somebody from outside of
the United States outside of North
America today we have two guys first of
all Daniel I want you to what’s going on
in Mexico what’s going on in Mexico in
terms of crypto the crypto scene down
there I haven’t heard too much other
than you know the regulations were
coming in before we could buy Bitcoin on
like gas stations like 7-eleven and
stuff like that but with the regulation
they took that option away from one of
the exchanges so they’re gonna have to
register you know the whole kyc thing
which is not a big deal but uh you know
you know I hope that they still you know
have the the intuition to go in by you
know because they heard it you know from
the World Cup commentator you know how
many people don’t watch that they heard
it so just go by it you know yeah I mean
that was glorious at the World Cup a
commentator on the spanish-language
Network in Mexico mentioned Bitcoin I
mean that was a free promo but I wanna
show your government it’s uh there’s
gonna be a new leader soon correct
unfortunately is so that’s so that’s the
direction that you if there’s going to
be more regulation to our Bitcoin it
appears I mean that’s right as you seem
to be implying there you seem to be a
little worried about that
I’m worried about the new venue
precedent as I came to find out one of
the contributors for the campaign is an
advisor to Evo Morales from Bolivia and
to Nicolas Maduro yeah and they’re tied
directly you know with the communist
views from Venezuela
yeah and that is that is what’s the the
rumors are that this guy is far leftist
well I mean if he if he tanks the
economy then unfortunately the Mexicans
will be forced to adopt Bitcoin if
they’re peso is starts to be a
hyper-inflated like what’s going down in
the land of Maduro and everything like
that well this is an interesting update
I I did not know that it there was there
were more ktyc regulations being imposed
upon you guys that’s interesting but uh
all right well thank thank you for that
update with anything else you want to
say about the Mexican scene down there
no not really it’s just you know I hope
they’re going by in of they’re listening
going by go buy a Bitcoin hell yeah
yes are it’s a great again for everybody
in the Central America South America
region you’ve seen what’s happened in
other countries it obviously can happen
in your country to the hyperinflation so
it coins a very nice
I think a nice insurance policy against
possible hyperinflation by communist
type thinking guys that’s a quick
question about Mexico
yes I’m just curious I’ve chatted with
so my friends in Venezuela and Ecuador
and other Latin American countries is
there a big like each bch Mexico chapter
because there’s like chapters of this
thing all over the world in different
countries and I’m just curious if
there’s one in Mexico if you know
anything about it like what’s going on
with Bitcoin cash down there if anything
there are people you know that that say
that Bitcoin cash is a real Bitcoin I
have only heard about one or two guys
but uh you know they they don’t have any
arguments they just say you know big
blocks are better and said with it’s a
block size increase like rocky Palumbo
likes to say yeah yeah yeah okay so no
youyou haven’t encountered any big B
cache of me nuts down there but that
means it’s Sur countries all of a sudden
you see whining like what where disco
yeah yeah no not really
okay that’s good okay let’s so let’s
move on to another country Adams coming
in from Israel um
what what’s the scene like there these
days at the Bitcoin Embassy in Tel Aviv
and beyond yeah there’s a few senior
there’s a few like crypto hubs the big
we’re never seen being one of them toy
lab there’s a molecule that’s landy by
in that area there’s a bunch of
different crypt of things there’s these
clusters actually I’m in a co-working
space now when there’s maybe like there
seven different critical companies um
nice face so crypto is very very very
big in Israeli say on a per capita basis
maybe one of the biggest if not the
biggest um interestingly also already
been tax opinions on a percentage wise
basis right on uh there’s already been
like tax opinions given by the by the
Braley tax authority of how you know
that they should how you should tax i ce
o–‘s what’s legal what’s not legal
um in getting some like Nate so so yeah
it’s actually it’s a very very vibrant
senior with regards to be cash I’ll say
that there
a few people that I know of who who
definitely are Probie cash um I’m not
very much against any cash let me put it
that way I understand the rationale but
the thing is that there’s a lot of
tribalism here and I think that would
eat happy but you can see going on
here’s you see like this the suppression
of ideas right um
there’s like at least internals just
like it’s either black or white kind of
aspect to the to the to the conversation
and yeah I guess it’s that way global
right either Provost or pro that um so
that’s a situation here on on e cash I
will say this when I was at the Tel Aviv
Bitcoin embassy there were all sorts of
people that were talking up other coins
and stuff there was a guy I remember
this guy from Japan who was pumping be
cash I think everyone was welcome there
I wouldn’t but if you’re in Tel Aviv and
people are visiting Tel Aviv they are
watching this show visit the the Bitcoin
embassy it is definitely a friendly
crypto environment true there are some
Bitcoin max list there but they were
guys talking about I see you know
they’re all all sorts of questions and
pumps there and a good crew it’s a good
central location I guess atom has there
been um when I was there
the Fiat price was soaring now that it’s
gone down it hasn’t been a has it been
less interest have been less people
showing up at the Embassy or or is there
still uh I mean obviously there’s still
a lot of guys technical guys building
things they don’t give a darn with the
prices but in terms of I guess general
talk has it has it lessons since the
price has gone down and Fiat so
obviously the news don’t work holes in
the him being the newspapers that gonna
stuff went down he used to be maybe that
was when you were year you’d have a line
we have a Bitcoin end that we have an
ATM in the embassy yeah there was like a
line around around the street it was
right around the corner people were
waiting hours to buy Bitcoin it was it
was amazing to see now that’s obviously
gone right but but you’ll see sometimes
like you know two three people in line
to buy it to buy Bitcoin so it’s open a
vibrant almost Sundays and Thursdays are
usually the times that there’s meetups
at the embassies and so and so if you
come on a Sunday or a Thursday you’ll
definitely see something there yeah it
was November right before thanks
in America I was there on a Sunday and
it was it was a great time it’s really a
good time and everyone’s speaking
English by the way for the people who
know their english is the language of
bitcoin basically okay Adam let’s I
would we were talking about Zen protocol
beforehand I’m a little confused with it
I thought it had a lot more to do with
atheria than maybe it does give us you
know give us a what is Zen protocol what
are you doing there with it this is your
being claim to fame in the ecosystem
right now so go for it what we want to
hear what curious I billing as anyone to
show like the coin showing showing but
okay so um about two years ago after
that that happened we can’t me and a my
partner were working on a different
project at the time a Bitcoin wallet
which was kind of like changed shifts
out and it was the better UI and then we
came and we said you know there’s if
they’re missing fit for purpose because
it’s trying to do everything
it’s the jack of all trades and master
of none and what people really want to
do is they want to they want to manage
their financial assets without without
being able to be censored without
counterparty risk without needing you
know third-party escrow agents etcetera
etc and to build the alcohol at form for
that um in the process I think we’ve
done so from a technical perspective
Italy and now the thing that we’re we
just had our Genesis block about a month
ago and another thing that we’re
focusing on is onboarding has many
financial instruments as possible to put
this so that’s that’s essentially where
we stand the the unique thing about our
platform is that um I think it’s the
first if you’re maybe familiar you have
like to kind of paradigms here going on
in the Crypt is basically a you TXO
system and you have like an account
slash virtual machine system of how it
works I think we’re the first like multi
token UK ik so they system and would be
but we being enable will be enabled
beyond having multiple tokens as we
enable you to program complex logic into
the system without requiring a VM the
reason that you would require a VM from
the get-go is because when you want to
have a language like solidity or or
serpent or whatever it is um
being compiled into you know executing
basically on a bunch of miners at the
same time you’re gonna have to you’re
gonna have to be able to say how many it
takes to execute that if you look at
some like Bitcoin strip the reason that
Bitcoin bitcoin actually has some more
contracts in it but if they’re they’re
not very good and the reason they’re not
very good is because the script is is
limited um the reason the script is
limited is for security purposes some of
them can mean vulnerabilities and others
can just be the fact that you want to be
able to look at the size of an exception
along is it validated um but we did is
mean we’ve used away using a this
spectral programming language called F
star which was built by Microsoft
Research in ingria we created a way that
you can tell how long it will take to
validate a computation um without having
to sit there and count the steps by
doing that we have a much more efficient
stronger faster and safer system that we
built in use it right now it is good a
you know same protocol calm um
downloaded in and try it out alright
well he’s also I linked to Adams well
it’s the design protocol Twitter is
linked to below all these guys Twitter
links below my Twitter by the way is
tech Paul Tec HP alt please follow me
there it’s been I mean it’s been on fire
over there obviously all sorts of links
below to get t-shirts treasures and my
events coming up I’ll be in LA or I mean
Boise than la than Philadelphia on the
18th of August all that’s linked below
ok enough about that guys we’re
approaching the end of the show I’m sure
everyone’s got some loose ends to tie up
things that weren’t brought up stories
that you would like to talk about we got
some time here Arjun what’s what’s going
on with you what it has there any
questions in anything before is yours
yeah that it’s that thank you I
appreciate that I think that you know
everybody listening should consider the
market right now explain kind of how I
look at it it’s basically a weighing
machine right you have thousands of
currencies everyone’s betting on what
has the likelihood of being the next
reserve currency you have a lot of these
currencies that are identical
I think someone in the comments then
should talk about like point I’m sorry
to say the light coin in my mind is
worth nothing
because it’s nothing but a Bitcoin
copycat in imitator which has no
fundamental technical innovation and is
attracted has attracted a large new
audience by getting listed on coinbase
when Charlie was director of engineering
he shortly left after and sold all of
his like point just about at the top of
the market and so you know a universe
where the founder of light coin doesn’t
own any leg points supposedly the the
product itself isn’t widely used and is
nothing more than a copycat of Bitcoin I
don’t think it should be worth nearly
what it is I think the market is too
rational to realize that in the short
term but in the long term you don’t
the term bag holders they used a lot of
crypto and sometimes in you know sort of
a strong sense where people say I’m
holding all these bags and they’re kind
of proud of it historically these parts
then you know the term bag holder came
about it’s because you know people were
left holding really stupid worthless
assets and so the thing that I would be
concerned about is that when the market
returns to a sense of rationality you
don’t want to be holding assets that are
you know fundamentally not
differentiated or valuable in a sense
you don’t want to be against the market
when it decides on money you want to be
with the market you want to have the
most liquid money you want to have the
420 that everyone accepts and where and
what people see is and so that’s the
only thing that could add to everybody
asking about litecoin everybody asking
about nano everybody asking about all
these hyper fast XRP all these hyper
fast better bitcoins like that’s what
that’s the main consideration i Wow
bitcoin is the next big coin people he
couldn’t have said it any better
pound that like money dude you saw the
I’ve had similar rants in my Dave I’ve
never heard such a litecoin rant before
that that was gonna really freak out the
the litecoin of freaks out you know I’ll
have a follow-up questions
because light point is so it is
basically just Bitcoin um again it’s
it’s not too special but it does have a
you said when will the market return to
being rational I don’t there’s so many
newbies you have to come in here that
this thing could go on for quite some
time I really think that some of the
Institute I think like when it’ll be
included in the ETF’s eventually I think
if it’s just somebody because it is
pretty simple it’s not it’s not that
I think there’s it’s its whole marketing
line of the silver to bitcoins gold also
little bit the soul part a big coins
gold is physical gold yes amen
but but I agree but I agree with Adam
that all these these shit coins are not
going away anytime soon like I have
humanities professors for my alma mater
who are emailing me how can I pay for my
son’s College with bitcoins I’m like
what like there are so many new people
who are still gonna discover Bitcoin
discover maybe how difficult it is to
build something on top of Bitcoin go to
aetherium maybe discover like coin hold
Doge because they think it’s cool all
these shit coins still have a lot of
life left in them unfortunately but that
doesn’t mean in 10 or 20 years all of
them aren’t gonna be dead and you don’t
want to be left holding them but
Seussical have that hopefully hopefully
hopefully yeah but I think realistically
they still have a lot of life left so
the sooner you realize what you should
be buying the better you will be stay
ahead of the curve your current haven’t
really begun to form I think they’re
going to be a tough there gonna be some
top tier at all coins they’re just gonna
survive it might not be the most logical
of reasons why they serve a high but
again it sure I don’t anyone get
confused here I am a one Bitcoin equals
one Bitcoin guy I am all about the
Bitcoin but I am just I’m just trying to
relay the story of what is going on on
the ground out here and like are
charging kind of made a joke about you
know people are asking me about like
when he said any single time I have a
show someone asked about like a
guarantee and then you get the eosin on
set and in the EOS is much more nonsense
and litecoin I got I gotta say if I I’d
like Charlie Lee by the way I like try
I want it he is one of the most honest
dudes in
the whole space yeah just uh I mean
that’s just a side comment there uh what
we say since we went on a little all
coin like coin rant I want Daniel it’s
chime mineral now what Daniel I need
anything you have to say about that
busier big Bitcoin maximalist but but
litecoin it’s only gonna be a test net
for Bitcoin and for people that are
hoping that you know there’s gonna be a
futures market for all queens that’s not
gonna happen to see any already
mentioned that it wasn’t gonna happen
and hey you know I have a coin that I’m
relating to called Bitcoin go buy any
thoughts on all coins I think that
extreme long-term and maybe that you
know pick one will be will be money and
it takes over the entire market in the
short term and I think we have
definitely three or four more of these
cycles to go through these bubbles on
the only asset perspective you know
what’s hot what’s not and in that market
where I think people should consider the
most is that there’s these you know the
assets that have a higher beta so if you
think about how the market moves so
these small altcoins they move more
aggressively move more aggressively down
and so people should take that into
consideration when when positioning
themselves but if you think you’re in a
bull market it may not be the worst idea
to even even if you’re ideologically
which I may be right against the
alternative may be that they just have a
higher beta that’s just how the market
now obviously you have things to do with
to pumping and who means there’s
actually any execution on the team and
etcetera etcetera
but then they you just think of it like
a stock portfolio with things which have
a low beta and that things I have a high
beta that’s the first thing I’d say I
think I’d recommend to everyone sitting
here watching this show right now is you
know maybe two years from now you’re
less interested in crypto because you
know it’s not hot it’s not in the news
anymore and what I really really
strongly recommend is for you to go now
Oh an account and just put a reminder in
your calendar for a year or two or three
years from now you know buy the coin
even so many dollars worth because you
know pretty one dollar in two years from
now that makes you to be at the point
where you’re making decision okay how
much are my portfolio don’t want to
allocate that Bitcoin is usually this
kind of like um the small inconvenience
that avoids people from making the
correct financial decision so make some
decision even
put one penny in and the last thing I’d
like to say is the first meeting which I
forgot to mention earlier is that people
who are creating real kindness of the
new financial instruments whether that
may be something that’s back-to-back
like tether or whether that’s something
that’s a custom exotic derivative um
whether it’s something because you
created with us with no backing or
because it’s collateralized on our
platform I’d be very happy to talk to
you um I think you have the best
platform to do that and looking for
people to build financial heart of
silence good good plug in there everyone
you could talk about yeah all your
things that you’re doing I love to hear
everybody’s personal stories and hear
everything thank you for that
Adam Daniel and what do you have –
anything you have to add that you forgot
to mention or something you wanted a
project you’re involved in anything
other than I’m not dead I’m starting a
new podcast it’s just you know as
there’s not gonna be any video it’s just
gonna be like something you can listen
to him to go and you know it’s just
faster for me to upload it and that’s
pretty much it yeah guys he’s not
staying all you all you do is in the
chat they’re like where’s 21 million
where’s Daniel he’s just rebranding he’s
in motion baby rebranding it he’s gonna
have the podcast well as soon as he’s
got all that stuff live you know I’ll be
talking about it and linking to it and
he’s always in motion trying to he’s
doing great things Daniel Daniel if you
can we you got to get that podcast in
Spanish man we gotta spread the good
word out there countries all over the
world not just for people that speak
English people all over the world should
understand what we’re evangelizing they
should learn I think it’s gonna be
really exciting time yes absolutely i
Stu I when I when I had my channel I
used to do it in English and Spanish you
know I could get you know wider audience
and yeah I know has been involved with a
few you know with Juan golf and you know
there were some guys we tried to
organize through this channel to get a
Spanish language we had a few we had a
Spanish language show one day I hosted
the show on here it was all in Spanish
and I had to be quiet most of the time
so I guess he for real
Aling that like button was gonna get the
eerie same thing that’s busy they come
here to hear did smart dudes talk you
guys the guess that’s what I love to
hear I don’t like your atomizer here but
I have to I have to say like being on
this show is so much fun because Adams
shows like the most high energy show of
all like I host a podcast it’s kind of
boring we just dive it’s only only an
all Bitcoin but Adams show is just like
the most high energy show
like seriously pound that like button
because being on this panel is a blast
listening to it as a blast it’s just
it’s the greatest Bitcoin show out there
so thank you very much Zak that is very
nice again I’ve been on Zak show – it’s
a good a good time so yeah give your
conclusionary remarks and talk about
your show and everything true so my
advice this is I can’t say this is
financial advice it’s not financial
advice but like you don’t want to be
chasing a bloomin asset once the bull
the major bull trend has already started
like I agree we have a few more small
cycles to go and even a rocket shot to
20,000 is a small bubble compared to if
it if the Bitcoin gold hypothesis is
true we haven’t even gotten started yet
so don’t cry yourself to sleep that you
didn’t buy at five dollars per Bitcoin
eight thousand dollars per Bitcoin long
term there is basically no difference
you should maybe strongly consider
buying some Bitcoin now more than ever
and if you want to hear me talk about
Bitcoin every Tuesday almost every
Tuesday I published a quick 30-minute
pod it’s at the coin pod on Twitter with
people who are actively contributing to
the growth of Bitcoin via development
research journalism teaching all of this
stuff it’s a fun show I have a fun time
producing it again you’ll listen to it
because of my guests and what they say
not because of what I say but check it
out the coin pod and and buy some
Bitcoin alright all these guys are
linked to below their Twitter’s are
linked to below so you can contact them
and asking questions and go to their
websites all right before I do my
conclusionary remarks does anyone else
because we have four guys on it’s a
special four guy panel use these three
anything else anyone would like to add
before we up we close it off just want
to say thanks very much for having me on
board and late
a very very good show one of my
favorites that’s that’s how we been
actually because I was already a fan and
think you know thank you for all the
good work you’re doing bringing bringing
the knowledge of thick went to the mass
market alright dude hey and thank you
and I look for hopefully man I’ll see
you again soon I got a visit Israel’s I
got a visit everywhere soon again
alright any other I know Arjun you just
dropped out there for a second any final
thoughts or anything like that no it’s
the the only recommendation I want to
give a shout-out to one of the best
Bitcoin maximals I personally know and
have learned a lot from have hung out
with and fall on Twitter his name is
Murad mud off his sandals must stop or
ODS yeah and let me tell you he cannot
be stopped you know what I have that
written down to contact him already
yeah thank you guys what am I trying to
getting him on this shows I love to get
new people quote-unquote new people and
so people who have been on the show for
Chris you’ve been or you’re new to the
show but you’ve been around it you got
an awesome Twitter feed and you were an
awesome guest today so yeah Hotel him
I’m gonna contact him and everything and
it’s just stuff I love I love bringing
all these dudes together okay everybody
that’s it I’m here in Edmonton next week
I guess of be coming from Boise anyway
i’m adam meister the bitcoinmeister the
disrupt meister i do do this this week
in bitcoin is every friday the time
berries I post a new show on this
channel every single day it’s usually
the one Bitcoin show Saturdays or the
beyond Bitcoin show so keep on tuning in
disrupt meister comm to get all my old
shows found that like button thanks a
lot remember offended by selling i’m
offended when people sell their I’ll see
you guys thanks a lot panel thanks a lot
everyone have a good Friday
shabbat shalom as they say cielo say yes


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